ok... so I sent a light fighter and a small cargo ship at a guy...
he defended with a light fighter and the weak laser defense turret...
my small cargo ship... that supposedly has a structure of 5000 dies on turn one to an attack of 156... like 4 turns later my light fighter... with structure 3000 dies to a similarly weak attack of like 148 or something like that... it makes absolutely no sense to me.
he then sent a small cargo ship to my planet like an hour later.
my 3 laser turrets hit his small cargo ship for over 300 damage every single round of the fight and his 1 small cargo ship survived for a draw.
can someone please help me understand how half the damage can kill my small cargo ship in the first round and my fighter like 3 rounds later when 2x the damage can't even kill the small cargo ship after like 7 rounds or whatever fights are...
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#2Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type S. Cargo. L. Fighter
Number 1 1
Weapon 4 52
Shield 10 12
Armour 400 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Solar Satellite. Light Laser.
Number 1 4 1
Weapon 41 1 87
Shield 12 12 35
Armour 300 55 100
The attacking fleet fires for 56 on the defender. The defender shields absord 56 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 132 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 21 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 47
Shield 11
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 51 116
Shield 13 35
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 47 on the defender. The defender shields absord 36 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 167 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 44
Shield 14
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 51 117
Shield 11 35
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 43 on the defender. The defender shields absord 32 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 168 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 13 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 52
Shield 13
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 54 115
Shield 13 29
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 52 on the defender. The defender shields absord 39 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 169 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 12 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 56
Shield 14
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 43 96
Shield 13 36
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 55 on the defender. The defender shields absord 40 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 139 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 13 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Destroyed!
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 42 93
Shield 10 31
Armour 300 100
The defender has won the battle !
The attacker has lost a total of 7.000 units.
The defender has lost a total of 2.200 units.
A debris field containing 2.520 units of Metal and 3.000 units of Crystal has formed in orbit around the planet.
Report created in 0.00228190422058 seconds
my cargo has 400 armor... and dies to one attack of 132... is this a bug? or are my small cargoes just crappy... and then just a little bit later... doing 300 damage a turn.. I can't even kill off one small cargo.
The following fleets faced Sat, 09 May 2009 04:30:44 +0000 :
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 10
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 108
Shield 28
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 324 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 9 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 4
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 113
Shield 29
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 338 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 12
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 107
Shield 28
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 321 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 11 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 9
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 102
Shield 27
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 306 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 8 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 6
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 106
Shield 32
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 318 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 11 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 107
Shield 26
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 321 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 0
Shield 0
Armour 0
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 0
Shield 0
Armour 0
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 0 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 306 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 0 points of damage.
The battle ends in a tie !
The attacker has lost a total of 0 units.
The defender has lost a total of 0 units.
A debris field containing 0 units of Metal and 0 units of Crystal has formed in orbit around the planet.
edit: bolded the space between the two battles to make it more clear... anyone know why my small cargo dies in round one and his lives through every round?
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type S. Cargo. L. Fighter
Number 1 1
Weapon 4 52
Shield 10 12
Armour 400 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Solar Satellite. Light Laser.
Number 1 4 1
Weapon 41 1 87
Shield 12 12 35
Armour 300 55 100
The attacking fleet fires for 56 on the defender. The defender shields absord 56 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 132 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 21 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 47
Shield 11
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 51 116
Shield 13 35
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 47 on the defender. The defender shields absord 36 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 167 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 44
Shield 14
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 51 117
Shield 11 35
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 43 on the defender. The defender shields absord 32 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 168 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 13 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 52
Shield 13
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 54 115
Shield 13 29
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 52 on the defender. The defender shields absord 39 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 169 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 12 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 56
Shield 14
Armour 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 43 96
Shield 13 36
Armour 300 100
The attacking fleet fires for 55 on the defender. The defender shields absord 40 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 139 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 13 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Destroyed!
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Light Laser.
Number 1 1
Weapon 42 93
Shield 10 31
Armour 300 100
The defender has won the battle !
The attacker has lost a total of 7.000 units.
The defender has lost a total of 2.200 units.
A debris field containing 2.520 units of Metal and 3.000 units of Crystal has formed in orbit around the planet.
Report created in 0.00228190422058 seconds
my cargo has 400 armor... and dies to one attack of 132... is this a bug? or are my small cargoes just crappy... and then just a little bit later... doing 300 damage a turn.. I can't even kill off one small cargo.
The following fleets faced Sat, 09 May 2009 04:30:44 +0000 :
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 10
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 108
Shield 28
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 324 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 9 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 4
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 113
Shield 29
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 338 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 12
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 107
Shield 28
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 321 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 11 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 9
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 102
Shield 27
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 4 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 306 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 8 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 6
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 106
Shield 32
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 318 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 11 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 5
Shield 11
Armour 400
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 107
Shield 26
Armour 100
The attacking fleet fires for 5 on the defender. The defender shields absord 5 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 321 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 10 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 10 %
Type S. Cargo.
Number 1
Weapon 0
Shield 0
Armour 0
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type Light Laser.
Number 3
Weapon 0
Shield 0
Armour 0
The attacking fleet fires for 4 on the defender. The defender shields absord 0 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 306 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 0 points of damage.
The battle ends in a tie !
The attacker has lost a total of 0 units.
The defender has lost a total of 0 units.
A debris field containing 0 units of Metal and 0 units of Crystal has formed in orbit around the planet.
edit: bolded the space between the two battles to make it more clear... anyone know why my small cargo dies in round one and his lives through every round?
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#3In my experience...
Defenses have a really low chance of destroying ships compared to ships.
Ships protected by defenses and a fodder have a great chance of survival.
http://www.zorgempire.com/forums/viewto ... f=2&t=1461
If Istalris is correct,then your enemy's small cargo just got lucky.
Defenses have a really low chance of destroying ships compared to ships.
Ships protected by defenses and a fodder have a great chance of survival.
http://www.zorgempire.com/forums/viewto ... f=2&t=1461
If Istalris is correct,then your enemy's small cargo just got lucky.
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#4yeah I read that... but a 400 armor ship should not be able to survive 300 damage 6 times... especially if this same 400 armor ship died after 110 damage in 1 turn... (we both have armor +20%... this being only our second day, I swapped a few confused messages with him about it afterwards and we talked a bit)... Its just very frustrating with how scarce resources are at the start to have your fleet wiped out by something that makes no sense since it is not reciprocal when you defend... really does not encourage a person to stick with the game...
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#5If the armor value resets every round then the SC just got lucky. Just a speculation though.Istalris wrote:A Destroyer fires upon a Battlecruiser for 4000 damage, 4000 is 40% of 10000. This means that from a single shot by a Destroyer there is a 40% chance that the Battlecruiser will be destroyed and a 60% chance it will survive. I beleive the armour value stays at the reduced value for the remainder of the round then resets to 100% at the end of the round.
This means if the Battlecruiser survives the shot from the Destroyer it is left with 6000 armour value, if it takes another shot from another Destroyer it's armour value is reduced to 2000, giving it an 80% chance to be destroyed and a 20% chance to survive. This would continue until there is a 100% chance to be destroyed.
...
I must remind you that this isn't an official statement
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#6if armor resets every round... how does
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type S. Cargo. L. Fighter
Number 1 1
Weapon 4 52
Shield 10 12
Armour 400 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Solar Satellite. Light Laser.
Number 1 4 1
Weapon 41 1 87
Shield 12 12 35
Armour 300 55 100
The attacking fleet fires for 56 on the defender. The defender shields absord 56 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 132 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 21 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 47
Shield 11
Armour 300
happen... 111(132-21sheilded) damage and my SC with 400 armor dies on ROUND ONE and is dead even with an LF to share damage with... and a few turns later to that same like 132 damage my LF dies and it has 300 armor... 300 damage and his SC lives every time without the LF fighting with it... I am just saying that the battle formulas are horribly inconsistent and if it continues... will probably result in my not playing because I am here to have fun... not feel like I got jipped constantly... I can understand some form of randomness to attacks... but this isn't randomness as I understand it... unless its like 2 million to one odds that both things happened back to back...
I really don't care so much about my losses... I care that its not even close to remotely even or fair or logical.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type S. Cargo. L. Fighter
Number 1 1
Weapon 4 52
Shield 10 12
Armour 400 300
Defender
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter Solar Satellite. Light Laser.
Number 1 4 1
Weapon 41 1 87
Shield 12 12 35
Armour 300 55 100
The attacking fleet fires for 56 on the defender. The defender shields absord 56 points of damage.
The defensive fleet fires back for 132 against the attacker. The attacker shields absorb 21 points of damage.
Attacker
Weapons: 0 % Shields: 0 % Armor: 20 %
Type L. Fighter
Number 1
Weapon 47
Shield 11
Armour 300
happen... 111(132-21sheilded) damage and my SC with 400 armor dies on ROUND ONE and is dead even with an LF to share damage with... and a few turns later to that same like 132 damage my LF dies and it has 300 armor... 300 damage and his SC lives every time without the LF fighting with it... I am just saying that the battle formulas are horribly inconsistent and if it continues... will probably result in my not playing because I am here to have fun... not feel like I got jipped constantly... I can understand some form of randomness to attacks... but this isn't randomness as I understand it... unless its like 2 million to one odds that both things happened back to back...
I really don't care so much about my losses... I care that its not even close to remotely even or fair or logical.
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#7Istalris wrote:This means that from a single shot by a Destroyer there is a 40% chance that the Battlecruiser will be destroyed and a 60% chance it will survive.
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#8Istalris also said...
I mean... he has to somewhat know what hes talking about, he has a very good ranking in the game so I trust he is onto something there... I just am trying to understand the game and get some confusion cleared up.
so the enemy SC survives round 1... and dies on round 2 by his logic...This means if the Battlecruiser survives the shot from the Destroyer it is left with 6000 armour value, if it takes another shot from another Destroyer it's armour value is reduced to 2000, giving it an 80% chance to be destroyed and a 20% chance to survive. This would continue until there is a 100% chance to be destroyed.
I mean... he has to somewhat know what hes talking about, he has a very good ranking in the game so I trust he is onto something there... I just am trying to understand the game and get some confusion cleared up.
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#9Let's say an SC has a 19% of survival and 81% chance of destruction for every round.
It is possible to survive all 6 rounds but the chances are slim. Still it is possible.
It is possible to survive all 6 rounds but the chances are slim. Still it is possible.
Re: I clearly don't understand fighting
#10Based on your combat report, your Small Cargo took 121 damage in the first round, it has 400 armor. This means it had roughly a 30% chance to be destroyed. I see no problem here.
In the remaining rounds, your Light Fighter was taking heavy damage, even to the point of having over a 50% chance to be destroyed. It is just based on luck.
Also, based on your report, you were doing no where near enough damage to have a significant chance at taking out his defensive turrets. I don't see a problem with this fight at all.
Nevertheless, if you do come across a really unusual report, like losing ships in almost impossible situations, report it and remember that there are a few bugs in the combat engine that are being looked at and solved by the admins in their beta server.
-Istalris-
In the remaining rounds, your Light Fighter was taking heavy damage, even to the point of having over a 50% chance to be destroyed. It is just based on luck.
Also, based on your report, you were doing no where near enough damage to have a significant chance at taking out his defensive turrets. I don't see a problem with this fight at all.
Nevertheless, if you do come across a really unusual report, like losing ships in almost impossible situations, report it and remember that there are a few bugs in the combat engine that are being looked at and solved by the admins in their beta server.
-Istalris-
